worthwhile to buy isf debenture?

Shrimpiggy

Hk has many wealthy people!

Shrimpiggy

Do you know how many debentures ISF sold? It is a very good to have 500mio funding from 100 holders...though the original values were only 1-3mio. If there is 200 debentures, there are 1billion capital for investment, the school is the biggest winner regardless the value of debenture when u cash out 13yrs later.
I think the government need to regulate the debenture otherwise there might be another Leman mini bond.......

Shrimpiggy

Yes, but who knows who trade it in the secondary market? Potential parents, the school, the board members of the school and might welcome money laundry ? For HKIS, CDNIS etc, at least I know I buy it directly from the school and all these transaction must be booked as non profit making Organizations required.

Shrimpiggy

I think u still can buy from school, but the queue is so long that no one can answer you....as it is selling at the listed price. But only ISF you can trade in secondary market that if you can offer a REASONABLE price, someone in the marketing might sell it to you.

Shrimpiggy

Hi HKTHK,
So far, no one knows how many debenture in the market and how many more it is going to issue. As you mentioned the secondary market transfer must go through the school and any price difference need to split with the school. As a result, the school taking the profit on the secondary market and controlling the number and price of new issues.
I am not a debenture holder but I doubt even the holders know how many debenture are sold and will be sold.

Shrimpiggy

Yes, as it must be a non profit making school, it is better to make their book more transparent to parents, debenture holders and potential parents.
I am here not to indict the school any wrongdoing but they can do more to let debenture stakeholders understand more.
For CDNIS, HKIS, the debenture can only purchase directly from the school, and in fact, there is not new issues for the last decades and there is a fixed price when u subscribe it.

Shrimpiggy

Yes, but the school is a non profit making organization, it must be more transparent than the banks should be. Otherwise, it is so risky to buy it as school has not much asset to liquidate for your money back if anything goes wrong.

Shrimpiggy

ESF provides a very comprehensive annual report and CDNIS has also published its annual report with financial data you can check it on this website.
GSiS got yearbooks open to parents and alumni only and their debenture is one of the lowest among all top tier IS in HK, $375k only, but you can buy it when the school offer you a place. It puts ability before commercial....
I think all other IS should follow.

Shrimpiggy

I am talking about the capital note but not the capital levy  everyone should buy.
I think it is more clear about how the capital levy works and it is clear enough to me.
I really don't know how the capital note can be traded in the market which is more than the 4.5mio offered directly by the school.

Shrimpiggy

Yes, there is only two kinds of debentures for GSIS (375k/250k) both are one off and not related to any placement priority.
Once HKIS, CIS, and CDNIS could be traded in the secondary market before but it is not possible anymore as everyone has to buy it from the schools directly. It is kinda self-regulation....

Shrimpiggy

Hi Shadeslayer, The 265k is the option B which is non redeemable. The 375k is refundable.

Shrimpiggy

You can ask to confirm that the school use Clause 11 to redeem the debenture as the disapproval of the transfer from the last few years. That's why there is no more debenture tradable in the market.

Shrimpiggy

It's a bit distorted that pricy one must be the best one.

Shrimpiggy

Yes....so don't follow the flock of sheep...

Shrimpiggy

It is true, the debenture liquidity is an issue thus it is not a transparent as stocks or any other investment products. For those real wealth people, they just need to  donate tens of million that their kids can secure a place without fight for the debenture. For billionaires, their fame is more than enough to make many good school to pre-empt a place for their grand children without doing anything.